Ok so with the first set of Ironhill dwarves releases spoiled, Dain, the warriors and balista. What's peoples thoughts on list building for them?

viewtopic.php?f=1&p=411374#p411374

Here's the link if you haven't seen them yet.



Initially, I am a little disappointed to hear the Champs of Erebor can lead them, because, not only are those really strong profiles, Dain is very expensive, and I feel like is going to get overshadowed by probably Dwalin and Thorin, although many of the other cheaper dwarves, paired with Thorin, like Fili or Kili might be good.

I did up a list at 500 with Dain on pig, Dwalin with 9 and 10 ironhill dwarves.



Don't love that list. Really low on numbers, Dori and Bifor might be worth looking at for cheapy troop caddies. Dori has three attacks! Another problem that stands out right away is that with all of the champs getting Dubekar if you take any of them without Thorin you'll be missing out, which I almost feel like relegates Dain to the third choice of heroes What do you guys think? There is of course also the ram riders and the chariot to come which I think maybe only Dain and Ironhills commander can lead which will shake stuff up for sure but what do you all think?

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Cheers,

P

I don't think Dain will be a third choise hero, unless in a low point match.
At 600+ I think the Dain is a better pick than Thorin King: better leadership qualities, higher courage, more killing power, terror when charging. Dain wounds D6 and D7 on 4+ and D5 on 3+ while Thorin will need at least 5+ most of the time. Plus, Dain has access to a mount with 2 wounds and D6 for only 5 points more than an armored horse: even Legolas will have trouble dismounting him.
Fiery temper can be a pain to deal with, but at least you don't have to charge or move towards the nearest enemy.

at 500 pts and less, Dori will be the first pick, with 3 attacks at +1 to wound and D8 followed by what should be an errata version onf Nori with D9, since he has both heavy dwarf armor and a shield and yet he somehow is only D8. It's a shame Bofur is only F4. His rule makes him almost immune to magic, but with such a low fight value he's bound find himself in trouble.

For a 500 points army I would take
Dwalin CoE and 12 Iron Hills Dwarves
Dori CoE and 12 Iron Hills Dwarves

With Iron hills dwarves, I don't think is possible to go for more then 2 warbands at that point cost, considering that the basic troop type is, by all means, an elite type and priced as such.

Totally yeah. I think at 600 you can squeeze him in. I'd always be a little skeptical about Dain as the leader with his charging rule though. He is super tough but if you're against wraiths I feel like one charge too far could really get him in trouble. What about just dwarf armies using Dain and the Ironhills warriors though? More as elites in a regular army. I haven't listed anything out yet but maybe running them with the old dwarves or with the warriors of Erebor in a mix to bring numbers up and what not.

Man, I wish Dain could have been a little cheaper and not str 5, just had burly or something. He's awesome but it sucks to pass him over for cheaper characters.

_________________
Cheers,

P

You can get some reasonable numbers if you take them with laketown, which would be kind of cool. 28 models, lots of might some cool bofa theme, decent in a stand up fight and maybe you could shoot some armies?

500 points, 28 models

Warband 1 12/12
Dain Ironfoot, King of Erebor
12 Ironhills dwarves

Warband 1 12/12
Bard the Bowman
4 Laketown Guard with Bow; Spear;
2 Laketown Guard with Spear;
6 Laketown Guard

Warband 2 1/12
Alfred the councillor
1 Laketown Guard with Spear;


You could drop Alfrid and the extra guy for the piggy or two dwarves. I doubt this is highly competitive but would be a fun game's worth at 500 I bet.

You can also get something like this? Army of Thror and Ironhills, fits a battle of azanulbazar theme! you can fill up a few more shields or maybe one less warrior, a few points to spare. 25 models, not a lot of versatility or flexibility though. If you can stand and fight though your heroes will chop through everything and your troops are super tough.

500 points, 25 models

Warband 1 7/12
Dain Ironfoot
7 Dwarf Warrior Iron Hills

Warband 1 8/12
Dwalin
4 Warrior of Erebor with Shield;
4 Warrior of Erebor with Spear;

Warband 2 7/12
Balin
4 Warrior of Erebor with Shield;
3 Warrior of Erebor with Spear;

_________________
Cheers,

P

At 500pts it´s very tricky to bring Thror/thrain cost dwarf heroe into the field like Dain...
However you can kinda mitigate this by adding other non hobbit forces into the existing ones...

*have to say Dain profile its so darn close to the one I presented here months ago* :P

My thoughts is that although dwalin might be better by a tiny bit than Dain since you can control him when its the fighting we´re talking about and overall cheaper, dont forget dain get a massive boost while on a thing most dwarves dont have... a mount.


Though I beleive that Ironhills with Dain at 500pts its almost unplayable...


Would rather try:

Warband 1
Dori, champion of Erebor
9 Iron hill dwarves

Warband 2
Oin, champion of erebor
8 Iron Hill dwarves

Warband 3
Balin, champion of Erebor
8 Iron Hill dwarves

This is just pure Iron Hills in which I highly doubt its effectiveness to be honest...

models: 28
might: 4


Warband 1
Filli, champion of Erebor
9 Iron hill dwarves

Warband 2
Oin, champion of erebor
8 Iron Hill dwarves

Warband 3
Killi, champion of Erebor
8 Iron Hill dwarves

models: 28
might: 5

2nd list replaced 2 Dwarf heroes for filli and killi...Sounds ridiculous? not so much to be honest...

Iron hills works best in tight up formations, such formations can come handy and swapping Fili and Killi at any phase in order to maximize your line efford might be important.
Doesn´t sound a sure strategy, but I beleive it might work just fine according to some situations, like protecting eachother from magic range and such by swapping the under spell brother for a viable one in front of the line screwing the enemy attack on your under spell enchanted heroe..... (and with it micro managing how surprised you will see your oponent realizing you sparing Will points vs spells cause of the swamp ability instead). (I would be even tempted to replace Oin with Bombur to help recover the under spell effect brother in the back)...


If you want to expand Filli and Killi Combo to 750pts then add this:

Thorin, king under the mountain with orcrist

Balin
5 Dwarves of Erebor with shield
- one of em with banner


its not the best ever.... but can be quite fun for a few reasons:

For 1º you give Filli and Killi banner effect cause of thorin
For 2º you add a quite nasty dwarf, aragornish kind of with might points.
For 3º you add a cheap balin so you can field in a few more dwarves and the precious banner...

Remember this list will likely suffer from shooting and slow grind... you will suffer a bit in battle...though you´re hard to crack..

I don't see dain's fiery temper as something as terrible as others seem to do. Unlike similar rules, you can still decided where to charge and he does not have to move towards the closer enemy.
Plus, he has the same cost as thrain, but with burly, more strength, more courage and fearless

Your second list there looks pretty strong. I think its probably worth dropping one dwarf and putting in Dori for Oin. Maybe even a Bifor for either Fili or Kili? The f5 on Fili and Kili is pretty good though.

This is exactly why I was bummed the champs could lead them because you probably won't get to see Dain much, especially considering how expensive he is. I suspect a pretty spammy list with lots of champs and Thorin is probably the way build, something along the lines of your 750.

@Dikey:
It definitely isnt thaaat big of a deal but I think every once and a while you'll get screwed cause your opponent could dictate his charge. He's so likely to kill though his heroic combats are all but given and you can kind of slingshot him around that way as long as he's got might or if you have Thorin or Bifor, once he's on one wound.

_________________
Cheers,

P

I might be being a bit dim, but looking at the pdf of the Iron Hills rules from the FW website, it doesn't seem to say anything about warbands being lead by the champions of Erebor - where's that info coming from?

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WIP thread: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=25860

Q&A with Middle-earth team at Ardacon

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You don't have to be great to start. But you do have to start to be great.

"Dain Ironfoot, Lord of the Iron Hills, Iron Hills Dwarf and the Iron Hills Ballista can all be included as part of an Erebor Reclaimed army list."

In that list are the champions of Erebor as heroes.