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| Archers - together or separate ? https://wap.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=32363 |
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| Author: | ja33 [ Mon Aug 01, 2016 11:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Archers - together or separate ? |
I'm going to NOVA this fall for my first tournament and I have a pretty basic question - Do most people put all their archers in one war band or do they split them up and put 3-4 into each separate war band ? What are the pluses and minuses doing it one way or choosing the other way ? Thx |
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| Author: | Steven bonnar [ Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
I'm in the same boat, I've found it's force/theme/scenario dependant. Mixed:- forces like Harad work well as mixed bow/spears as the spears support the archers in combat and the bows harass the enemy early. Non mixed:- useful for the non support archers who are the to pick out targets with massed bow fire but are vulnerable if cut off from your combat support. Full cav:-rohan riders one of the best cav in the game for it ability to be a utility model with now, shield and throwning spear on a horse. this is were I am deciding if I want rohan infantry in support or another force to increase my average defence in my force, |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Tue Aug 02, 2016 3:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
I general Steven is right. Dedicated archer units like mirkwood rangers, orc trackers, and uruk-hai crossbowmen are better as concentrated warbands. But even things like rangers or elves with spear and bow are better, imo, when concentrated in a warband with a 6 by 6 spread then just 2 or 3 in every warband. That way you don't need to slow down your entire army to shoot from a formation. |
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| Author: | ja33 [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
Thanks for the informative replies. I was leaning toward 4 bows in each of 3 warbands, but going 6,6 0 might make more sense with my elves. My concern with putting all 12 together is I've seen lots of times where those bows either get left too far behind the rest of the army or the flow of battle plus trees & buildings blocking off line of sight can make all those bows grouped together much less effective, and thus, only maybe 50% or 66% of the army is able to contribute... |
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| Author: | Dikey [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
ja33 wrote: Thanks for the informative replies. I was leaning toward 4 bows in each of 3 warbands, but going 6,6 0 might make more sense with my elves. My concern with putting all 12 together is I've seen lots of times where those bows either get left too far behind the rest of the army or the flow of battle plus trees & buildings blocking off line of sight can make all those bows grouped together much less effective, and thus, only maybe 50% or 66% of the army is able to contribute... Putting the archers in the right place during the deployment phase is extremely important. As a rule of thumb, they are the last units I deploy. In my last game, Domination, I managed to pick the perfect spot for a warband of 12 orc trackers, and they made their points back very quickly by concentrating their bow fire on rangers and supports. Had I split them up, half of them would have had to made far more difficult shots at harder targets. Plus, they are worthless in a fight, so there's no reason for them to be even near the frontline. Even if those are orc bows, I found out that 12 shots on a small area each turn can be a thorn in my opponent's side: they thinned the line enough to allow the infantry to break and encircle Rangers are different. They have a higher fight value then their soldier counterpart and have access to spears, which means they can make the difference in a fight. |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
I use high elves a lot actually and when I have the points I split the archers into two warbands of 6 a piece led by a stormcaller to help with getting the right placement. Plus I always give my guys spears and turn them into a reserve line in the latter stages of most games. The trick, imo, is to use the archers to bring the enemy to fight where you are and not to leave your bowmen to shoot while advancing your own infantry. |
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| Author: | Dikey [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
Wan Shi Tong wrote: I use high elves a lot actually and when I have the points I split the archers into two warbands of 6 a piece led by a stormcaller to help with getting the right placement. Plus I always give my guys spears and turn them into a reserve line in the latter stages of most games. The trick, imo, is to use the archers to bring the enemy to fight where you are and not to leave your bowmen to shoot while advancing your own infantry. It depends of the kind of archers. There are pure archers and versatile archers. Pure archers like trackers or Ruffians with bows have to find the best position and keep shooting as long as possible. They cannot act as a reserve line, and if splitted they may not have the strenght to deal significative damage. Elves with spear and bows, are a whole different story. |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 3:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
What are you on about Dikey? It's elves ja33 said he had and it's elves I was talking about. |
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| Author: | ja33 [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
That's my bad, I wasn't clear in my original post. I'll be using either Wood Elves or High Elves. Sorry for any confusion and appreciate all the info being shared. Any other thoughts on deployment in general ? |
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| Author: | Steven bonnar [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
A nice raised area(never seen one yet!) While using elf bows Strength-3 your looking at picking off or concentrating(mission dependant) on either high priority targets or numbers of kills. Vs hordes focus on banners, hero's, spear support etc of odd defence numbers, 3-5-7! Vs elite go for what can hurt your force which is probably the same things as above but also monster's. Do you have a list in mind we could see? Always good to get as much info as possible to make an informed decision. 
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| Author: | ja33 [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 8:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
What ? You want me to give away my "super secret" NOVA list in advance for all to see ?!?! LOL Sure...will post it later tonight when I get home and find my pile of papers with crossed out lines everywhere
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| Author: | Steven bonnar [ Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
Or a list of current and available models! 
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| Author: | ja33 [ Thu Aug 04, 2016 3:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
I'm much more of a collector than a gamer, so my list of available High Elves basically includes everyone; both old Elronds, Gil-Galad, Glorfindel, Twins, Erestor, Gildor, Arwen, Cirdan, Stormcallers, Captains, etc....and plenty of warriors - 36 archers, 36 blades and 24 spearmen, plus 3 or 4 banners Don't have my full list in front of me, but I think it was looking something like this. Low on numbers of course, but don't really see much way around that... Gil-Galad, horse, shield 6 spearmen 2 blades 4 archers Twins, horses, armour 6 spearmen 2 blades 4 archers Erestor 6 spearmen 2 blades 4 archers |
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| Author: | Dikey [ Thu Aug 04, 2016 7:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Archers - together or separate ? |
Wan Shi Tong wrote: What are you on about Dikey? It's elves ja33 said he had and it's elves I was talking about. You are right, is my mistake. I read the topic on the phone before answering and I miss the "high elves" part. Quote: Twins, horses, armour 6 spearmen 2 blades 4 archers You have to drop 1 unit. When playing with Elladan and Elhorir, one takes the role of Warband Leader, the other count as a follower. |
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