The One Ring :: View topic - 700pt Isengard competitive???

Hey guys, first time post! A bunch of my friends and I have started playing the middle earth battle game recently, and we're all experienced wargamers. I myself only played Lotr when I first got into tabletop stuff a good 15 years ago, and probably 4-8 games in the hobbit edition. As such we don't have a huge handle on what's 'OP' and whats pretty reasonable. There are obvious outliers (Balrog, Harad hoard with betrayer, Azog, defiler of reasonable points costs) but I have tried a couple of lists, and this one seems to stick out as a bit of a powerhouse, as it's undefeated thus far.

700pts Isengard

Saruman

6 warriors w shields
4 warriors w pikes
1 warrior w banner
3 berserkers

Vrasku
8 warriors w crossbows

Captain w shield
5 warriors w shields
3 warriors w pike
1 berserker
3 scouts w bows.

11/34 bow limit
37 models = break point of 18 dudes and actually 66% break point of 12. Games end at 9 homies left alive.

My other lists run Lurtz and a troll instead of saruman, and usually Mauhur and a bunch of his marauders instead of the captains warband. Vrasku and 8 crossbows are a mainstay in the army.

So is this something I should be looking at taking to tournaments?? Or do my friends just suck :rofl:

Thanks for any help/ advice you can give me guys

Author:	Tanksie [ Thu Dec 20, 2018 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:	700pt Isengard competitive???
Hey guys, first time post! A bunch of my friends and I have started playing the middle earth battle game recently, and we're all experienced wargamers. I myself only played Lotr when I first got into tabletop stuff a good 15 years ago, and probably 4-8 games in the hobbit edition. As such we don't have a huge handle on what's 'OP' and whats pretty reasonable. There are obvious outliers (Balrog, Harad hoard with betrayer, Azog, defiler of reasonable points costs) but I have tried a couple of lists, and this one seems to stick out as a bit of a powerhouse, as it's undefeated thus far. 700pts Isengard Saruman 6 warriors w shields 4 warriors w pikes 1 warrior w banner 3 berserkers Vrasku 8 warriors w crossbows Captain w shield 5 warriors w shields 3 warriors w pike 1 berserker 3 scouts w bows. 11/34 bow limit 37 models = break point of 18 dudes and actually 66% break point of 12. Games end at 9 homies left alive. My other lists run Lurtz and a troll instead of saruman, and usually Mauhur and a bunch of his marauders instead of the captains warband. Vrasku and 8 crossbows are a mainstay in the army. So is this something I should be looking at taking to tournaments?? Or do my friends just suck Thanks for any help/ advice you can give me guys

Author:	ja33 [ Fri Dec 21, 2018 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
Looks like a good list, and also like the Lurtz version....Isengard was very tough with the Hobbit rules, and they are still tough now in ME SBG Sure, take it to a tournament and see how you do....and yes, t's also possible that perhaps your friends also suck ! LOL Let us know how you get on, and which version of the list that you ultimately decide to go with...

Author:	Cave Dragon [ Fri Dec 21, 2018 4:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
Tanksie wrote: Hey guys, first time post! A bunch of my friends and I have started playing the middle earth battle game recently, and we're all experienced wargamers. I myself only played Lotr when I first got into tabletop stuff a good 15 years ago, and probably 4-8 games in the hobbit edition. As such we don't have a huge handle on what's 'OP' and whats pretty reasonable. There are obvious outliers (Balrog, Harad hoard with betrayer, Azog, defiler of reasonable points costs) but I have tried a couple of lists, and this one seems to stick out as a bit of a powerhouse, as it's undefeated thus far. 700pts Isengard Saruman 6 warriors w shields 4 warriors w pikes 1 warrior w banner 3 berserkers Vrasku 8 warriors w crossbows Captain w shield 5 warriors w shields 3 warriors w pike 1 berserker 3 scouts w bows. 11/34 bow limit 37 models = break point of 18 dudes and actually 66% break point of 12. Games end at 9 homies left alive. My other lists run Lurtz and a troll instead of saruman, and usually Mauhur and a bunch of his marauders instead of the captains warband. Vrasku and 8 crossbows are a mainstay in the army. So is this something I should be looking at taking to tournaments?? Or do my friends just suck Thanks for any help/ advice you can give me guys That is a good list. Use it!

Author:	Tanksie [ Fri Dec 21, 2018 10:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
So nothing crazy, but a pretty good list? Sweet. For reference some lists I've faced are... Fiefdoms. All 4 special characters leading a force of their own type Easterlings. Amdur on a horse with knights, a dragon knight dude, a captain and a war priest. They're leading a healthy mix of bow warriors, black dragons and warriors, some with pikes. Mordor. Knight of umbar on horse, with lots of moranon orcs, Grishnakh with more moranon orcs and a black guard captain leading a troll and a bunch of black guard Mordor. Shagrat leading black guard, a great beast of gorgoroth and a captain with archers and moranon orcs. Rohan. Theoden, Gamling and Erkenbrand leading many many riders So far I've found Uruk Hai mach up well against moranon orcs, crossbowmen are the bees knees, woodland creature is good, D6 is good, berserkers are hawt, but my weakness seems to be that there is no strong combat character in the army. Mauhur is a great troop killer and can kill lesser captains, same with Lurtz. But Amdur and Imrahil are real bothers. Saruman takes all that out of the equation, though I am yet to test him against the Easterlings, he has dominated in games against the others. Sorcerous blast against cav is gnarly and transfix is bae. Imrahil never made a strike in the game I played Fiefdoms!!!! The troll constantly under performs. Every bow shot seems to wound him, characters use might to beat him and then he dies. I've had the odd game where he's beat up some infantry or cav, but never 110pts worth. I've thrown dudes and barged to hit nicer targets, but throwing just ain't what it used to be.

Author:	Hewhoisnamed [ Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
My experience has been the same with the trolls. I play Mordor and for some reason I really struggle getting value out of them. Taking it as a chieftain really helps but still.

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Author:	Cave Dragon [ Sat Dec 22, 2018 11:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
Yes, useing a Mordor Troll Chieftan can work well. It is preferable to break shieldwalls and to try to dismount heroes, but if you are not facing Iron Hills or Gondor, I would not bother. Besides, Isengard has no chieftan option.

Author:	Phantom_Lord [ Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
The isengard troll also suffers from only being F6, whereas most big good heroes are (at least) F6. I also didn't use to like trolls but i'm running an angmar army now that has one. It's a cave troll though, and with its smaller base and being 30pts cheaper then an isengard troll it's just more bang for buck. D8 vs D6 isn't going to help a troll much anyhow vs most big heroes. On the topic of the above list, I like it and if i'd play isengard i'd look something like that. But in my experience elves (which are a VERY common army in tournaments, at least where I live) counter you quite a bit with their F5 and generally superior shooting.

Author:	Tanksie [ Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
El trollo is F7. And yes, Elves suck. Have played then twice now for 2 very narrow losses

Author:	Cave Dragon [ Sat Jan 05, 2019 12:10 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
Phantom_Lord wrote: The isengard troll also suffers from only being F6, whereas most big good heroes are (at least) F6. I also didn't use to like trolls but i'm running an angmar army now that has one. It's a cave troll though, and with its smaller base and being 30pts cheaper then an isengard troll it's just more bang for buck. D8 vs D6 isn't going to help a troll much anyhow vs most big heroes. On the topic of the above list, I like it and if i'd play isengard i'd look something like that. But in my experience elves (which are a VERY common army in tournaments, at least where I live) counter you quite a bit with their F5 and generally superior shooting. Cave troll is fight 6. Mordor/Isengard trolls are fight 7. I suggest 1 in a non-horde army.

Author:	polywags [ Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
I just played an event, my second ever, and there were two isengard lists playing on the top table. It was 600 points and they both just had a ton of uruks. Lurtz, vrasku, Ugluk, 36ish? uruks, 12 xbows, in the winning list. They seem pretty good in this edition. I would probably go for saruman at 700 though, seems like a good call, although it cuts into your numbers some.

Author:	Tanksie [ Mon Feb 18, 2019 11:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 700pt Isengard competitive???
Saruman is a beast, and the only real protection Isengard has against other legendary heroes. Not sure I'd ever play Ugluk in a competitive environment though

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