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Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
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Author:  Sticky Fingersss [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
http://observationdeck.io9.com/leaked-h ... 1448314474
Author:  Bartelomeus [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Battle of Dol-Guldur... sweet.
I'm way more excited about the models to be released from DOS than I was from AUJ, more full scale army potential, can't wait!
Author:  LordElrond [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Very interesting. Can't wait for Thranduil and the elves.
Author:  Lorindol [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Bartelomeus wrote:
Battle of Dol-Guldur... sweet.
I'm way more excited about the models to be released from DOS than I was from AUJ, more full scale army potential, can't wait!


Same here! As I have a huge Mordor army and an army of Elves there is way more potential for exapanding my collection that in AUJ..

I really hope they come out with some mean dol goldur orcs! I though the hunter orcs were so very petty

:pray:
Author:  Bilbo [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Looks like we are getting a Necromancer model as well as a new orc siege weapon!
Author:  Dr Grant [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 5:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
The other interesting thing is that the orcs in these sets are called Gundabad orcs whilst the ones that came with the Warg Attack box were called Hunter Orcs. It certainly bodes well for us getting a new range of orcs this December, perhaps the bigger ones from the flashback in AUJ are now guarding Dol Guldur in DOS.
Author:  Bilbo [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 5:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
It seems that we have more off an ambush than a siege at Dol Guldur, with at least 2 new orc varieties. More heavily armoured orcs should be amusing.
Author:  Beowulf03809 [ Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
One issue I think GW is going to be hitting against is what can they do to make any "new" Orcs attractive for sale. Sure they may be great looking models because the new look the movie gives us, but if they don't fill a special niche on the table they're probably going to flop in sales.

Between Orcs, Morannon Orc and Mordor Uruk Hai we have most of the basic combos of F/S/D covered and the wargear options are pretty complete. So I fear we are going to have another case of stat creep and get a new basic troop that's either more powerful or has some extra special rule and we're going to move even further from the very balanced playing field we had a few years ago (IMO the slope started slipping with Harad supplement but didn't really get steep until they translated some new WotR units back into SBG).

Likewise with Elves. What is an armored Mirkwood Elf going to be except a Galadrim or Rivendell Elf. But if they want to sell new models there's going to have to be some gimick.

And all of this continues to leave Gondor, Rohan and probably a few other 'classic' armies further behind without any real reason to re-baseline the whole mess.

So yeah...looking forward to new models and options but dreading what the marketing demons might do to the game in the name of new profits.
Author:  Draugluin [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
All I'm hoping for is that after the Hobbit movies are done and GWs license is about to run out, they release 1 book with every profile from LotR and one for every profile from TH, perfectly balanced against each other so that even though we have a few years of OP orcs or whatever, we can be left with the rest of our days to play an actually balanced game. Just my hopes.
Author:  Lorindol [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 8:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Draugluin wrote:
All I'm hoping for is that after the Hobbit movies are done and GWs license is about to run out, they release 1 book with every profile from LotR and one for every profile from TH, perfectly balanced against each other so that even though we have a few years of OP orcs or whatever, we can be left with the rest of our days to play an actually balanced game. Just my hopes.


yes that would be nice
Author:  samoht [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Beowulf03809 wrote:
One issue I think GW is going to be hitting against is what can they do to make any "new" Orcs attractive for sale. Sure they may be great looking models because the new look the movie gives us, but if they don't fill a special niche on the table they're probably going to flop in sales.

Between Orcs, Morannon Orc and Mordor Uruk Hai we have most of the basic combos of F/S/D covered and the wargear options are pretty complete. So I fear we are going to have another case of stat creep and get a new basic troop that's either more powerful or has some extra special rule and we're going to move even further from the very balanced playing field we had a few years ago (IMO the slope started slipping with Harad supplement but didn't really get steep until they translated some new WotR units back into SBG).

Likewise with Elves. What is an armored Mirkwood Elf going to be except a Galadrim or Rivendell Elf. But if they want to sell new models there's going to have to be some gimick.

And all of this continues to leave Gondor, Rohan and probably a few other 'classic' armies further behind without any real reason to re-baseline the whole mess.

So yeah...looking forward to new models and options but dreading what the marketing demons might do to the game in the name of new profits.


Well hopefully they may not give the new orcs a huge stat creep but instead will keep them close to "average" but will give them one thing that makes them stand out. A bit like the hunter orcs. The hunter orcs are pathetic except for their extra attack which I think is kinda awesome. It leaves them pretty plain and killable but also gives them something special and awesome. Hopefully the same will apply to Gundabad/dol Guldur orcs. Perhaps they are resistant to magic or something. I don't know sounds kind of lame but you never know. Something different like that would be good.
Author:  Dr Grant [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
I agree, I don't think there has been an awful lot of power creep in the Hobbit releases. Grimhammers and Hunter orcs have as many problems as they do advantages and even the Rivendell Knights are hardly broken, they're as expensive as they are effective. The characters too haven't broken the game, Thror has a great rule but is in trouble when it fails, Thrain's got the 2-handed issue, Azog's got a low defence etc.

I actually think they did a good job of balancing a lot of the Hobbit profiles. There was definitely Evil power creep before that (Morannons, Feral Uruks, Blackshields) that essentially covered up the weaknesses in certain armies but I don't think it's been too prevalent with the Hobbit.

I agree that they'll hopefully have similar stats to other orcs but with a special rule. Looking at the first film I'd expect a new breed of Gundabad orc to be something like F4, S4, D5, C3 (no option for shield, spear or bow). The lack of spear support and D6 would be a nice enough change to them I think but I think they'll have something else on top of that.

I also strongly doubt they'll ever combine the two ranges, unify them or revisit them again. Beyond the IP issues I don't think GW has any interest in developing the game, you just have to look at White Dwarf, there hasn't been a single article about SBG since the December issue. As lovely as it would be to have a unified 'Battles Of Middle Earth SBG' in 4 years time I think it's far more likely that that whole range will just sit on a website for a few years until the license expires and they quietly remove it.

Make the most of December's White Dwarf chaps, the safe money says it'll be the last SBG content for another year.

It truly is a great shame, particularly given how much, IMO, the Hobbit rules and model range have improved and revitalised the game.
Author:  Bilbo [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 11:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
you just have to look at White Dwarf, there hasn't been a single article about SBG since the December issue.

For a major range that really is disgraceful!

Make the most of December's White Dwarf chaps, the safe money says it'll be the last SBG content for another year.

I suspect that without an unplanned and unexpected significant rise in interest translating into purchases, this will be true.

It truly is a great shame, particularly given how much, IMO, the Hobbit rules and model range have improved and revitalised the game.[/quote]

Personally I still believe that it is a great well balanced game. Rules for more orc breeds are quite possible dependent upon the imagination of the games developers. I personally think the hunter orcs are great miniatures with sound rules. They have a bit of a punch but, are quite squishy, and £20 buys more of them than Mordor Urk Hai.

The last thing I see G.W. ever doing is releasing one book with the entire range in it, especially when the time comes to put the range to rest, or more likely send it to the glue factory.
Author:  Robshaw [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
They have the I.P License till 2017 , so i guess get buying once that I.P contract ends , prices will SKYROCKET! alternatively if you cant afford to get a full collection. Do what i told my friend who is poor... Synthesize a cognitive thought that makes you FEEL like you have ENTIRE collection , RELAY RELAY RELAY RELAY ... keep self prophesying and eventually you will convince yourself you have entire collection :)
Author:  Bilbo [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Just because they have the licence until 2017 does not mean that it won't be renewed.
Author:  Robshaw [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 1:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
If the sales keep dipping , would you keep the I.P if you were GW getting ever closer to making a loss?
Author:  Lorindol [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
As mentioned before.. I think.. eventually ... GW wil let the middle earth range fade quietly.. everything will become OOP..

"the world of [LOTR SBG] will fall, and all will come to darkness, and [this forum] to ruin"
- Boromir to Aragorn in the fellowship of the ring -
Author:  Dr Grant [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 3:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Robshaw wrote:
If the sales keep dipping , would you keep the I.P if you were GW getting ever closer to making a loss?


Robshaw speaks the truth, sadly the days of SBG being a huge money-maker for GW are long gone. If the license is to 2017 then I would severely doubt it'll be renewed, that's the perfect length of time for GW to ride the wave of popularity created by the last film in Christmas 2014 and then slowly wind down production over the next three years.

In their defence people clearly aren't buying the range, I went to SELWG last Sunday and spoke to a couple of independent GW suppliers and neither of them had any Hobbit stock, they didn't stock it as it wasn't popular enough. Now obviously some people aren't buying the sets due to the cost but SBG is no more expensive model for model than WH/40K and people still buy them, there simply isn't the player base.

As much as we can complain that GW aren't supporting the range, there's also an element that we can control. GW only runs 1 Hobbit TOS and 1 Hobbit Battle Brother per year compared to 3/4 or so for WH and 40K, at this year's doubles there were only 16 teams, compared to last year's 46.

When attendance at the ONE doubles event of the year falls by 66% in one year you can hardly blame them for assuming that the game isn't popular.

That info will all be fed back to HQ, next year it's already looking iffy if there'll even be a doubles, which given they can give a weekend over to either 32 SBG gamers or 100 40K gamers is a decision that's hard to argue with.

The upside (in the UK at least) is that the last year has seen a fantastic growth in the indie circuit with 7 SBG tournaments organised as part of the League. This is a great foundation that we will continue to build on in years to come and hopefully develop a really robust UK tournament scene. The only way to keep this game alive is to attend these events and so I heartily encourage you all to do so.

Anyway, back on topic, mmmmmmm Lego.
Author:  Robshaw [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
I think what we will see now is a stagnation inbetween the films , during the summer time after all the models had been released , still another 2 years + of releases ... nothing to complain about :) good times cant last forever. 2001-2017
Author:  Robshaw [ Tue Oct 22, 2013 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Leaked Lego sets give hints for Desolation of Smaug
Just wait till Christopher Tolkien dies , hes 88 so i reckon within next decade and BOOM SILMARILLION = NEW FILM=NEW MINIS , that's hoping his offspring sell the I.P.
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