Hello everyone. Lately I ve been thinking alot about siege rules after looking at Battle of Pelennor Fields and The Relief of Helm's Deep scenarios in official WoTR rulebook (which as we know has no rules for sieges). And after checking some rules in SBG i came up with the picture of how the siege could (should) look. I was trying to make the most reasonable rules so you can easily understand them and what's more they dont violate (or at least they seem not to) the ones made by WoTR creators. (i would like to ask you to read my whole post before you make any kind of comments) So here we go:

All walls are treated as Defensible Terrain Feature (but dont have Capacity) so the defenders standing on them get the defense bonus from any kind of attack. For every formation being on wall (both attackers and defenders) 2 warrior models present 1 company (every company/model in formation must touch each other) and different formations cannot touch each other. Place the defenders' formations in any (legal) configuration you want wherever on walls you want (note that the garrison towers on the wall has thier own capacity). Only infantry formations can be placed on walls. The only way to climb up on walls and attack defenders (except shooting of course) are ladders and siege towers. Every company can carry ladder (but only 1 ladder each company). Carrying the ladder requires 4 warriors and only infantry companies can do that (but you dont have to carry the ladder "for real" just remember that this unit was pointed as "carrying the ladder"), so 1 company of 4-8 warriors is able to carry 1 ladder with full speed. Now rules for the fight of formation with ladders:

a) When the formation with ladders is charged by the enemy they drop the ladder and the fight phase continues with normal rules after the fight is resolved and the company is not disordered they can keep carrying the ladder or quit carrying it.( but they can still come back for the ladder during their move phase and pick it up by touching the marker of ladder with formation/company movement tray).
b) When the formation with ladders is charging enemy (except charging walls of course) they also must drop them (doesnt matter if the ladders are carried by front or rear ranks of formation, if they decide to attack enemy they want to use as much strength as they can get). They must leave a marker for each ladder behind the formation at the start of charge phase. When the fight is finished the formation can go back and pick up the ladders by touching it with bases or leave it so the other formations can pick it up (the formation that touches ladders decides how many of them they want to pick up). Ladders (markers) lying on the ground are not treated as difficult terrain and dont stand in line of sight and formations that decide not to pick them up can move over them with no penalties.
The ladder is automatically dropped ones the number of company reaches below 50 % of it (3 and less warriors). Ladders cannot be carried by companies with two handed weapons (like pikes or berserkers company in Isengard army) and spirit formations (if you are asking yourselves a question why companies with shields can carry it here is an explanation: shield is carried in one hand and weapon in the other so they can hide their weapon and grab the ladder with one hand).
When the formation with ladder touches the wall (by the normal move or charge) it rises the ladder automatically and is counted as attacking the defenders (but if touched the wall in move phase they can be shot at normally). Attackers can charge the walls in the same way as the defensible terrain feature is charged. The fight proceeds with the same rules as described on page 55 of WoTR rulebook with every bonuses for defenders and penalties for attackers ( i rly hope most of you has the rulebook or know the rules because i dont feel like i would like to write the whole paragraph here :p). The exceptions for attacking the defensible terrain feature are: the formation that raised the ladder can attack with only 1 company per ladder risen and other companies in formation cannot make supporting attacks. The standing ladder top end is counted as the base of company (so the attackers can attack formation on wall closest to ladder's end). The ladders can be placed in front of spearhead or command company and if there is no more room for ladders (because of other ladders) place them as close to them as possible. If the ladder's top or part of siege tower is in front of two different defenders formations multiple fight occurs. Important thing is that only front ranks of defenders attack the attackers on ladders/siege towers while the rear ranks make supporting attacks and what's more each 1 company of attackers can be normally fought back by maximum number of 3 front rank defending companies (the rest of formation make supporting attack). Ones the attackers has taken the place of defenders (which lost the fight and are not steadfast, and remember that each 1 attacking company is presented on the walls as 2 warriors' models) they can charge in their charge phase another defenders but this time all the rules for regular fight are applied ( defenders are no longer counted as being in defensible terrain feature and all combat modifiers are used). If the defenders are fighting both with charging enemy from the side and the other on the ladder/siege tower they must choose which company attack which attacker (remember that companies charged in the flanc get -3 attacks etc). If the number of the attacking companies of formation is too great to fit in the spot left they must choose whether not to go up or to separate some of the companies from formation so they become 2 independent formations (the command company should always go up the wall and they may join again once there is enough of place on walls for every company [but dont have to]). The ladder cannot be pushed away from wall as long as there is at least 1 company of enemy within 3" of it (that represent the fact that any enemy formation/company within 3" would be trying to climb the ladder or when its down on ground immediately rise the ladder up) but if there isnt any enemy formation the defenders that are in front of ladder push it away automatically in their move phase and it can be only raised up in the move phase of the next turn by attackers. The attackers doesnt make panic test after losing the fight they are always steadfast (it represents the determination and number of attackers, all they care is to reach the wall) but they must make all terror test (because still can be afraid of attacking a terrifying enemy). If attackers win the fight the defenders must take panic test (i was also thinking that they could be always steadfast too just holding thier ground but then i thought about couple of examples and i think that the defenders spirit is sooner or later broken if they cant stop the attackers and they leave their positions while starting to flee or just are forced back) and if they are not steadfast they must leave the defensive terrain feature (the wall). Ok i think that should present quite a clear rules for using ladders. Now for the siege towers:

Siege towers have the capacity 4 (or below - the player's choice). They can be moved by trolls (2 trolls full move, 1 troll half of move) The trolls pushing siege towers can be shot normally but the shooters must have line of sight. The siege tower should be at least 120mm width (2 x 60mm round base of trolls). The companies inside the tower can shot at the defenders and the same is for defenders shooting at siege tower. Companies inside siege tower get +2 defense bonus because of occupying timber defensible terrain feature. The trolls cannot charge as long as they are pushing the tower (they must quit pushing it at the start of their move phase if they want to charge this turn) and can be charged with normal rules (the attacker must be in base contact with trolls not the siege tower). The siege tower cannot charge the wall, ones it touches it in move phase every company inside is counted as attacking the defenders. Attackers can normally fight using number of companies equal to half of capacity of tower the rest is making supporting attack. Neither attackers nor defenders get the bonus for charging or occupying defensive terrain feature. Again the attackers are always steadfast while the defenders must take panic test when they loose a fight. If the defenders lost the fight and they are disordered they must leave the defensible terrain feature (the wall) and attacker can immediately occupy it. The attacking formations that has ended their move touching the siege tower may climb up on walls as soon as there is some place for it (they will not touch other formations on wall). And now for the rules of attacking defensive terrain features by siege machines:

The siege machines cannot attack walls (and i think about walls strong like the helms deep or minas tirith ones) but can attack gates and siege towers (or other siege machines but then all the rules are in wotr rulebook). If no formation is in line of sight (and that means ANY formation no matter if close to siege engine or next to the gate) the siege can fire at the gate but with no +/- modifiers. Roll a D6 if you wanna attack the gate with siege machine, on 4+ you hit the gate, then roll another d6 and on 1-5 you deal one hit with the siege machine strength and on 6 you deal 2 hits with siege machine's strength (wooden gate have a defense of 7 and resilience of 5, iron gates have defense of 10 and resilience of 7) (i didnt use the ordinary artilery table for attacking gates by siege machines because you can simply notice that they are never used to destroy the gate because of their low aim and effectivness against the gates). Battering rams can also smash the gates (but not siege towers) when a battering ram is touching the gate (by move or charge but doesnt get bonuses for charging) it attacks it. The battering ram is presented in WoTR rulebook on page 174. The only exception is that the battering ram has a strength of weakest crew member + 1 per every additional member. So if you look at the picture of battering ram of isengard army on page 174 of rulebook you see that it has a strength of 4 +3 (four members) so its 7. As for battering rams i thought that some people would like to make it equipped with stronger monsters like 2 trolls (i think two trolls is a maximum number to carry the battering ram). From what i calculated the battering ram itself cost 30 pts (with uruks it cost 50 pts but average cost of 4 uruks is 20 -rounded up) so you can just add the cost of trolls for battering ram and here you go. This kind of battering ram would have a strength of 7 +1 which is 8. Anyway you can even make huge battering rams of your own creation like "Grond" from Minas Tirith siege. In this case i think that pushing The Grond at full speed needs at least 4 trolls so it has a strength of 7 +3=10 (which is maximum strength). Just remember that every kind of battering ram can make a maximum number of 3 attacks per phase. And now for the last thing that i think remains to be described is attacking siege towers with siege machines. Siege machine can attack companies occupying it using the WoTR rules for Artillery shots (page 61), after you counted the casualties out roll a D6 (but only if the siege machine made some casualties). On a roll 1 you deal no damage, 2-5 you deal 1 automatic hit and on 6 you deal 2 automatic hits (and siege tower have resilience of 3).Once a siege tower is destroyed any companies left must leave (the same rules apply as for exiting defensive terrain feature, page 53) Hum hum i think that s all the rules i wanted to present to you i tried to make them as simple, close and similar to wotr rules as possible so everyone can understand them and enjoy if decides to use some of them. Anyway i am looking forward for your opinion about them. (just one note before i finish for good - i made the resilience of gates so high because they are the doorways of great fortresses and it cant be just too easy to break them down.) Take care

EDIT (nov 16, 2011): I implemented all the previous changes (fight on walls mostly) in the post + made some corrections.
EDIT 2 (nov 16, 2011: I made some minor changes for siege machine's rules.

Bit of thread necromancy, but I think its a shame no one has replied to this! Thank you a lot for sharing your ideas. There are quite a lot of interesting, easy-to-grasp concepts here. I was wondering about your idea of having two Warriors representing one company; does each warrior, in this case, have Resilience 4? Also, I think it would make more sense to have all eight models per company, or how many ever are alive by then, on the walls, just fighting as individuals, and then have companies regroup when they enter the city, rather than have two models represent eight models (hope I didn't read that incorrectly). I was also wondering about your experience actually using these rules in a game--how did it go, if you've managed to play any?

I think normal warriors should also be able to move siege towers. (maybe say min. 2 coy formation. 1" for every point of strength and +2 for each additional company). Otherwise, it looks quite good and well thought out. My compliments

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"... Telchar wrought it in the deeps of time."
-On Andùril, The Lord of the Rings